V-drive sound level

[POG]

Though POG is a 1977 P 365 her engine has only about 970 hours on it at present.  The oil in the V-drive is is clear and looks like it just came out of the can.  I try to live by the saying: "If it ain't broke, don't fix it" - however, the V-drive "sings" a bit.  Normal and healthy - or not?

Carl

[Dale Tanski]

Carl,

Mine sang when it was sick.  All new Bearings, seals and universal joints later, and it makes not a peep. You can not hear it over the engine what so ever.

Dale

[kevin barber]

I can tell you that my newly rebuilt drive does make some noise if you listen closely.  It sounds like multiple bearings whirling simultaneously.  This is a normal sound.

I experienced some excessive noise with mine a few years ago.  

The sound got worse over the course of a year and became more of a high pitched squeak/ squeal.   I also started noticing some play in the jack shaft where it entered the v-drive.  This lead me to rebuild mine, where I found a blown out u-joint.    These things are built pretty darn tough because everything else inside was in perfect condition.  

The hardest part of doing a rebuild is removing and pressing in the new u-joints without loosing any needle bearings. Everything else inside is pretty quick.

Check for any play in the jack shaft input.  This would be an indicator of a bad u-joint.

[graemek]

Hi
check the mouting bolts to the hull are not loose if thay are not solid thay can vibrate a bit,how loud is it ?,can you here it standing up in the cabin....needs looking at,with you ear within a foot OK put kettle on and relax

[POG]

Thanks for the good input, though the opinions seem to vary from Dale's dead silent to Garner's audible with ear within one foot to Kevin's sound of healthy bearings at work.  I am taking the boat out today and the forecast is for ENE at 3 knots, so the engine is sure to get used.  I will certainly check for jack shaft play and possible loose mounting bolts.

Carl

[POG]

Graemek!  I am sorry I called you Garner in my previous reply.

Actually got some good wind yesterday, 13-15 knots, and had a great day on the San Francisco Bay.  It is a pleasure to discover how well the boat sails in spite of shallow draft  and double sticks.  We seem to have endless sunshine this autumn, so a great time was had by all.  Even my wife seems to be falling in love with POG and speaks of the boat with pride.  That was not expected...

I don't seem to have any noticeable play when I grab the shafts in and out of the V-drive and try to jiggle them.  The drive is also bolted down firmly.  However, there is no doubt that there is a steady humming when the drive is in operation which can easily be heard and distinguished from the engine noise.  It is not a very sick humming though - and I will live with it a bit longer I think.

What I would really want to do is to send the drive to Dale and have it come  back dollied up in lacquer paint, gleaming and sound-less, as I know it would be.  Have you ever thought of setting yourself up in the business of fixing 365/367 problems, Dale?  No one alive knows this design better than you do - or so it seems to me.

Carl 

[Dale Tanski]

Carl,

First off, expand on "Even my wife seems to be falling in love with POG and speaks of the boat with pride.  That was not expected..."  Is she not a boater/sailboater?  She did not like this particular boat because... She likes this particular boat because of?   Please if you would, give us a little more on this thought, or please have her post.  This is very interesting to me.

Second, you send it, I'll fix it, you just tell me the color.

Dale

[POG]

Dale,

Beware of sentences like "you send it I'll fix it".  You might find a heavy parcel on your doorstep!

I am not sure that this is the place to reveal the secrets of my marriage, in particular as concerns that constant rival, the boat (past and present), to my wife's claims on me.  Briefly, my wife is a Swedish ex-Pan Am stewardess of solid farmer stock.  No seafaring traditions in that corner.  She has lived with a number of boats and my absences as crew in an attempt on the North West Passage, away to sail Alaska several summers, endless weekends working as a sailing instructor on the SF bay.  She has put up with it because she is a great person.

We both agree that long ocean passages is not something for her.  However, she has sailed with me extensively on our little Spencer 25 up and down the coast of Northland, New Zealand, when we lived there. She spent weeks with me cruising the Sea of Cortez on TOOTSIE, my beloved but oh so tiny and flawed Yankee 30, before I single-handed the boat to Tahiti, where I had to sell her and give up on reaching New Zealand in her in 2006.

The thing is, my wife has tolerated all these boats and adventures, but there is a new gleam in her eyes on board POG.  She actually likes this boat and keeps saying good things about it, which is a new and strange development.  There is something about the 365 that seems to be appealing to landlubbers and sailors alike.  The size, the looks, the great cockpit, the roominess and feel below - a lot of things are just right and better.  Personally, I am very happy to find that POG is not a pig under sail.  I wasn't expecting much in that department.

Carl

[skier842]

Just the other day while running down the Intracoastal my vee drive started to "rap" a loud rapping sound. I shifted into neutral and unfurled the jenny. The noise stopped but I need to go back in gear to keep from getting outside the channel. After about two hours of running the rapping stopped. We were able to anchor for the night and I checked the oil level in the vee drive. It looked like water had gotten into the vee drive. I added some transmission oil. The next day I restarted the engine and shifted into gear and the rapping restarted since there was not marina around we proceeded down the intracoastal, after about two hours the vee drive got quiet again. After reading recent posts about the vee drive I thought someone may have had the same problem. As soon as I get to a place to open up the vee drive and possibly make any repairs I will. I may also sent it off to Dale for his magic wand repair.

George

[Dale Tanski]

Yo George,

I don't do rap.

Dale

[skier842]

I have since pulled the plug on the vee drive and a messy looking grey almost liquid came out. I then flushed it with ATF oil a few times then added the 30 wt oil. I seams to run a lot better. I'll change it again after a few hrs of running to see if gets any better.

George

[skier842]

Well it happened, When starting to take friends out for a sail we cleared the dock and backed out into the channel when I went into forward she didn't move forward but it would go in reverse. We drifted into a convenient slip and with help got her docked. This morning I wasn't sure if it was the tranny or the Vee drive. I pulled the cover off the transmission and everything look in place with nothing loose the oil was a bit dirty so I changed that but the cover back on and disconnected the shaft to the vee drive started the engine and it seemed to run with out making the clunking sound both in forward and reverse. Those facts tell me its the Vee drive.

Having read about other rebuilding the Vee drive I'd like to know how to go about it, where to start and get parts. Do I need to remove the whole vee drive or can it be rebuilt while still mounted in the boat. We hope to be heading for the Dry Tortugas this week end or shortly there after.

You can call me with info at 801-745-4035. Since I'm short of time I might just start calling some of you for the info.

George

[Dale Tanski]

George,

Could there be a stick or a length of rope that wraps around the shaft in forward?
What happens when you turn the shaft going to the V-drive?
If it is the V-drive you will have to remove the box to totally disassemble it.  You can get the parts from the good people at Walter or you should be able to have a good bearing supply house match everything up and save a little money.  The only part that may be harder to find locally are the universal joints at the discharge end.  They are also a pain to change as they are so small.  Walter will be able to E-mail you an assembly drawing which you should have as it is not obvious how it all comes apart.  A press for removing and reassembling the bearings is also necessary.

Good luck
Dale

[RayNWanda]

Before you pull the vee drive, take the top off and take a good look. You should be able to see some metal in the bottom of it if it has failed. Ed Houston I believe, picked up a tarp one time backing out of his slip. Seems like his boat would move in one direction but not the other.
Docks are notorious for having lines and junk hanging around. Something wrapped up in the prop can make all sorts of terrible noises. The solution could be that simple.

[skier842]

A diver happened to be nearby and checked out to see if anything was caught in the prop. It was clean. I pulled the vee drive out and one of the bearings was totally shot. I had Walter Machine send me a rebuild kit for $330.00 with shipping. They would have repaired it for that price but with shop time. I would have been a better route to go as a local shop is doing the work as I don't have the bearing puller or a clean place to insure not small being parts stay behind to start more distruction. I will also have them paint it. I should have it back by Thursday. I'll install it and go for shake down before heading for the Keys with a lot less weight in the wallet.

George