Problem with Tapered Cone Seacock by Wilcox-Crittenden

[bioandy]

Hello all. I'm going through all the Wilcox-Crittenden seacocks and thu-hulls on my recently acquired 1976 Pearson 365, and I have a dilemma with one of them.  I've probably read everything there is to read on the internet about refurbishing these tapered cone seacocks, but haven't seen anything that addresses my particular problem.  Hopefully, somebody can comment.  All the other seacocks have been cleaned, lapped with grinding compound, greased and reinstalled with no problem.  The problem I'm having with one of them is that upon reassembly, the cone seems to protrude through the housing so much so, that the narrow end actually protrudes past the seacock housing, so that the adjusting nut bottoms-out on the threaded stub before the cone is snug in the housing. There is just too much play between the cone and housing to make a proper seal.  The seacock seemed to operate fine with no apparent leaks before disassembly.  I can't imagine that I lapped so much material off that I created a sloppy fit. None of the other seacocks' tapered cone plugs protrude past the housing (on the narrow end). Thought I'd see if anybody had a comment before I replace the entire seacock.  Thanks for all comments.
Andy

[Dale Tanski]

Andy,
If my memory serves me correct, there is a thick washer on the nut side that keeps the nut from bottoming out on the base of the threads.
Yes/no?
Dale

[bioandy]

Andy,
If my memory serves me correct, there is a thick washer on the nut side that keeps the nut from bottoming out on the base of the threads.
Yes/no?
Dale

That's correct. The flat washer has a flat in the hole which indexes the flat on the threaded end of the cone. This flat washer hits the end of the cone before it touches the seacock housing, preventing the cone from being drawn in to the housing. The adjusting nut should pull the cone through the housing as the flat washer bears on the housing, but the cone is already protruding past the end of the housing. Maybe I should have said that the flat washer bottoms-out on the end of the cone before it bears on the housing.

[Dale Tanski]

OK...
I had one that the tapered cone broke on one side of the hole. I serviced it, greased it and reinstalled it.  I saw what I thought was just a surface imperfection.  I didn't think it was a crack, just a score from a barnacle or something. 

In my case it leaked after launch.  No problem I thought, I will just snug up the nut and it will stop.  NOT, the water flow got worse. That is when I put two and two together and realized the score was more than a surface imperfection, it was indeed a crack.  I ended up installing a hose clamp around the cone/handle/nut which when tight kept the cone in shape and allowed it to seal.  I was very concerned that if the other side of the hole broke the two ends would part company and down she would go. 

Of course parts for Wilcox Crittenden are no longer existant.  Once the boat was pulled, I removed the tapered section, drilled and taped a screw hole from the end and installed a flat head screw to keep the cone from "bending". The bending when the nut was tightened was enough to allow the nut to run out of threads as the cone effectively got longer.  When I launched I also installed the hose clamp retainer just for safe keeping.  No leaks, worked like a charm. This winter I purchased a 30 year old replacement off of E-Bay and will replace the entire unit shortly.

Check your tapered core an very look closely for a crack.

Dale Tanski

[bioandy]

Thanks Dale,

I have the cone with me and it looks solid.  But, you got me thinking that a crack in the housing could result in the same condition of "cone being too long", as the housing can spread, creating a bigger bore, and the plug traveling deeper. Will have to examine more closely at the boat.  Either way, the seacock will be coming out tomorrow.

Here's a photo of the problem seacock showing the protruding tapered cone, next to one that shows a properly seated recessed cone end. (1st time photo upload - hope it works)

http://s1360.photobucket.com/user/bioandy/media/Wilcox-Crittenden%20Seacocks/compareseacockplugs_zpsc4c1ba82.jpg.html#/user/bioandy/media/Wilcox-Crittenden%20Seacocks/compareseacockplugs_zpsc4c1ba82.jpg.html?&_suid=136580507228102213356603514754

Andy

[Dale Tanski]

Andy,
Did you work on them one at a time?  Is there a possibility you may have mixed them? If one was slightly smaller in diameter and one larger mixing them could result in the same situation.  That little crack in mine allowed the cone to bend.  I can't imagine it bent much or it would have broke but that little bit made all the difference in the world.

As an example, if the angle of the cone was 6 degrees that would mean the rise over run would be 1 to 10.  This would mean if the cone was .002" smaller in diameter the cone would nest .020" deeper.  .020" smaller (less than 1/32") would mean .200" deeper or a little over 3/16". It wouldn't take much.  Just a thought.

Dale

[bioandy]

Dale,
Good thought, but only worked on one at a time.  Agreed, wouldn't take much change of diameter to make meaningful difference in depth. Hopefully I'll know more later. Planning to remove the seacock later today. Thanks for your thoughts.
Andy

[bioandy]

I think I confirmed that too much valve material was lapped off. Since posting my original question, I did one more valve and was very conscious of how far the cone was recessed in the body before dismantling. After cleaning and lapping, which I felt was not overly aggressive, I created the same problem with this valve as the original.

Not knowing the history of my seacock maintenance from previous owners, I can only assume that my valves were on their "last lap."

I'll be investigating a couple of "fix" ideas while looking for replacements.  I'll post any successful remedies if that happens.

Andy

[PeteW]

I replaced  my cockpit drain thru-hulls valves with flange mount Perko S/S ball valves. I also found a Teflon Grocko ball valve that I put that on the holding tank. I found all these parts on eBay for around $100 each. I just didn't care for having to loosen the nut and beating on them to get them to turn. See  "below the waterline restoration".

So I have 3 of the tapered valves in my bronze scrap bin if your looking for replacements or parts.

Tartanic

[bioandy]

Thanks PeteW/Tartanic,

I actually was able to locate some (NOS) new old stock WC seacocks.  Paid $150 ea for the 1.5" cockpit drain valves and $100 for the 3/4" seawater intake valve for the head. I should be good for another 35 years.

Nice post on the "below the waterline restoration."  I'm glassing in fiberglass backing plates for  the new seacocks.

Thanks again,
Andy