Injector Pump Leak

[SailingSeaDragon]

All,

My injector pump has developed a leak around the throttle shaft. I have spoken with several Westerbeke/Perkins mechanics including the Westerbeke rep, all agree that it is possible to remove the seal and replace it but VERY likely that the pump will need to be recalibrated. All have suggest that I remove it and send to be repaired & calibrated by a shop with the necessary tools and skills. Some have even suggested I have it rebuilt while it is out, after all it is 35 years old with 1,600 hrs on it....

Engine: Westerbeke W40 (Perkins 4-108) with a Lucas CAV Fuel Injection Pump (painted red)

Now for my questions:
1. Are there any tricks to removing and replacing the pump such as shaft alignment, timing or.....?
2. Should I have it rebuilt while it is out & at the shop?
3. Any recommendation on a shop to do the work?
4. Any advice before I start this project?
5. Any suggestions on yoga exercises before crawling into the starboard locker???

My plan is to winterize in December and pull the pump once I have completed winterizing so that I am not rushed.

Thanks,
Garner

[SVJourney]

I've done this job several times (don't ask, it was a complete goat rope )

Make sure that the index marks where the pump mounts are aligned.  If not then make your own marks with a cold chisel or a file or a Dremel.  Make them deep and easy to see so you can put it back where you were.  If no marks, then timing the engine to the pump is VERY hard and time consuming when the engine is installed. The procedure for retiming is in your engine manual.


I would do a bench test instead of an overhaul.  That gets you a reseal so no more leaks.  If it doesn't bench, they will let you know and then go for the overhaul.

Have plenty of beers available prior to starting.  And a few Bandaids.

The only thing you should have to do in the locker is to disconnect the exhaust and a couple hoses.  Everything else is done from the companionway.

Remove as much cabinetry as you are comfortable doing.
Drain coolant
Remove the exhaust manifold
Remove the injection tubes and send them in with your pump for cleaning/painting
Remove the supply and return lines and be careful with them, I managed to kink one.
Remove the internal wrenching bolt, you will need a hex driver for this.  I made my own but cutting a small piece of Allen wrench and inserting it into a socket with glue.  Or you can buy one at Sears.
Remove the two nuts (big fun getting the bottom one but not too difficult)
pull the pump straight back to clear splines.  The spline shaft may or may not come out with the pump.  Don't send it with the pump, you may not get it back (learn from my fail).  I find it easier to reinsert the pump with the shaft on the pump versus in the engine.  The shaft has a master spline so you can't get it wrong.  Make sure you marks line up when you reinstall.

Takes me about 3 hours to remove and replace.

[FBNOODLEMAN]

Hey S/V Journey:

Is it necessary to put the engine in TDC BEFORE you remove the injection pump. I have a Westerbek 50 and have a small fuel leak near the area where the pump attaches to the engine. It will be necessary to remove the altinator before I can really see it, but maybe its the fuel return fitting?? If I pull the injection pump, will timing be an issue when reinserting it, assuming that I make some scribe marks as long as I do not turn over the engine?? thanks for your response. jim on Toothpick

[SVJourney]

I don't know about the WB50, but on the 40 it does not matter at all if it's at TDC or not as there is a master spline on the injector pump.  The timing marks do matter as the pump mounting holes are slotted so you must align the pump housing.  It would not matter if you moved the engine while the pump was out, it would still align because you are aligning the housing, not the internal workings of the pump.

Hope that helps ya,
Wayne

[SailingSeaDragon]

Wayne,

Thank you for the in detail information - I have been away for the last few weeks. I finally made it to the boat this weekend to take a closer look at everything. Everything you said makes much more sense now. It looks like that once the exhaust is removed the removal of the CAV pump is tight but straight forward - I know, how many times have I said that....

Thanks - will keep you posted on my progress. I do not think I will start this project until late December or early January.

Garner

[FBNOODLEMAN]

I just finished the injector pump reseal job. It was impossible to see the CAV Lucas metal tag while the pump was installed, but from one of the guys on this forum, told me what his CAV injector pump was and some references back East. So I called and got the correct seal kit, and, after removing the pump from our boat, had it resealed, and bench tested, and now its back in the boat, and running fine. Apparently, the CAV pump has a small hole near the gear and when the lip seal fails, it starts dripping fuel out the little hole, telling you that the seal is gone, and needs attention. All is well now on Toothpick,,,jim BTY, member P39 has the references to the suppliers of reseal kits. j

[P69]

I think you are referring to the info i this thread regarding suppliers for your  pump reseal kits:

http://www.pearson365.com/forum/index.php?topic=1593.msg8455#msg8455

I'm glad it worked out for you.

[SailingSeaDragon]

Finally got around to removing the injector pump and injectors today.

Wayne thank you for notes and guidance it was very helpful. Next stop is an experienced diesel shop.

I have one question - What the heck was Perkins thinking when they designed the upper allen bolt?
                                  They could not find another 1/2 inch of space around it?

It took me about 4 hours to drain and remove the exhaust and another 3 1/2 hours to remove the injectors and pump.

I think it will all go back together in 3 or so hours. That is if I can ever get the silly allen bolt started... I have no idea how I will get it back in behind the pump unless I can find a 2 year to reach between the pump & engine to position and start the bolt.

Thanks again for you help..

Garner

[SVJourney]

Garner,
For the allen bolt I used 2 12" extensions, a swivel at the allen driver and fed if from the companionway.  wrap some tape around the swivel so it stays somewhat straight.  I glued the bolt on the driver after dropping it under the engine a couple times. 

[SailingSeaDragon]

Back from the shop and reinstalled - Pump and injectors rebuilt. Best of all this is one of the few projects that came in under budget.

Thank you Wayne for all the help - install and cleanup took less than 4 hours. As it turned out the hardest part was aligning the drive shaft. I took your advice with the upper inboard bolt. I tapped it to a socket, used a wobble extension, and once it was close I used a magnet to pull it into place.

Now I waiting for launch to prime and start the beast.

Garner

[brian chalk]

My injection pump also has the slow leak from both the throttle and shut-off shafts whenever the engine runs. After reading this thread, I worked up the courage to attempt to remove the pump for rebuilding. The engine is a 1981 Westerbeke 40, and the pump looks identical to the one in Garner's last post, except a lot uglier. I have removed the six fuel lines (four injector and two low pressure.) I managed to get the hex head bolt out, and the nuts off the other two mounting studs. As I removed the two nuts, I was expecting to feel the pump become loose, but it won't budge. It feels like it's welded to the mounting flange. Have I forgotten to remove something that is holding it in place? Might there be some corrosion somewhere?  Do I just need to use a little force to try to get the pump free? Any advice would be appreciated.

Brian

[SVJourney]

The pump goes on with a paper gasket, likely it is just glued on.  Gentle whacks with a mallet, then a putty knife between the flanges if that doesn't work.  The shaft and mating surfaces are pretty robust, so you can use a little force.

[brian chalk]

Wayne,

That was just the encouragement I needed. Whacking on a putty knife with a mallet did the trick. The pump then easily separated from the flange and out it came.

Thank you!

Brian

[brian chalk]

So I am ready to re-install my injector pump and injectors. I see in one of my manuals where the hold-down nuts for the injectors are supposed to be torqued to specific setting with a torque wrench. I don't own a torque wrench and wondered if it is necessary to buy one just for this one job? Would I be okay just tightening the nights down snugly, or is it recommended that I use a torque wrench?

[SailingSeaDragon]

The Saga continues...

I finally had a chance to bleed and start the engine. I starts fine, runs nicely but I have two problems:
    1. Idle is at 0 rpms - I have to move the throttle about 1/5  for the engine to reach 500-600 RPM
        the previous idle RPM.
    2. The max RPMs under load or no load is 2,500 not 3,200 (no load) and 3,000 (under load) that I had before.

I was very careful to align the pump with the marks I made before removing.

The throttle control on the pump moves from stop-to-stop so it is not a simple cable adjustment. The throttle lever does not move as far forward (up) as it did before. Once the lever stops I checked the throttle on the pump is tight against the "Max" throttle stop.

Any thoughts - I will call the shop that did the work tomorrow to find out what thoughts they might have on the issue...

Thanks
Garner